single presses or multi-presses for pressing 300 mugs?

[socialgiraffe]

Could I jump into this thread and ask those that oven sublimate how important or quick you have to be to remove mugs from oven once time is up followed by removing wraps and then paper from mugs if you're doing 12 at a time? With mug press then we remove single mug and paper within about 5 seconds of end time to get under fan otherwise sublimation still occurs and print over bakes or ghosts (double print if paper has moved). So with 12 in an oven then I imagine our process wouldn't be viable.

I echo what others using ovens say, time is not as critical as you would think and its all about finding that sweet spot between time in oven and temperature. Its a bit like any dye sub method. You can often reduce the time and increase the temp and get the same results. The higher the temperature the bigger the risk on things like ghosting. My oven fits 24 mugs at a time, that takes between 16-18 minutes. When the timer is done I take them out, put another 24 in and only then I remove the wraps. Sometimes I have waited 5-10 minutes before removing the wraps if I am distracted etc.

Which brings me to say that you might want to look at your times and temps in the presses. I have (and still do) use single mug presses and for a fair few years used a five at a time mug press. I never dunked the mugs in water and once I found that sweet spot between time and temperature I never got ghosting. In theory your mugs should stop "printing" almost as soon as they are removed from the heat source. The only reason they would continue is because the temperature is possibly too high and allowing the ink to continue. It might be worth reducing the temp and increasing the time.

Please do not think I am trying to tell you how to do your job on your kit, you know better than anyone what works for you, just a friendly observation :-)

[carolm1a]

I always use a mug oven, ive got 2 - an st3042 and then one of the smaller 3d oven's that you are "supposed" to be able to fit 4 in....I've never used anything else other than these. To be fair 200-300 mugs a day would be enough to give me a heart failure but....for my measure 5-10 a day they are ace :) if you need a spare wrap, just let me know and i'll send you one, I have loads extra :)

[greenroom]

Excuse me jumping in too.... this is all so helpful: I'm trying to find that ideal mid size oven option and have been all through the threads re: smaller halogen up to standard kitchen oven.

Ideally would like benchtop size - social hope you don't mind me clarifying - are you talking about here the Blizzard BC01 Convection you mentioned in an earlier thread? Looks like it could fit 24 mugs.

Bit confused on the gassing issue (noted a layer of paper may help) - is that not an issue in a convection?

ALSO (squeezing them q's in, but while I'm here.....) did I read about using a Combination Microwave (and not using the microwave, obvs) so as to get even heating through the rotation (but you couldn't stack?) did anyone try that, or remember if that was in another thread? thanks! :)

[socialgiraffe]

are you talking about here the Blizzard BC01 Convection you mentioned in an earlier thread? Looks like it could fit 24 mugs.

Yes, that is the oven I have.

Gassing is an issue no matter what method of printing you use. In actual fact, it is probably more of a problem using ovens and wraps than it is using a mug press. Gassing basically occurs when there is too much excess ink. I will do my best to explain but it is quite complicated and I am not the best at explaining things :-) ....

As we know, dye sub ink turns into a gas during the printing process, this is why the image must be tight on the surface it is being printed to. If we want to bleed an image off the top and bottom of the mug you have to make the image bigger than the mug. Most people will make the mistake of giving 5mm top and bottom. All that excess ink turns into a gas and needs somewhere to go which is why you will find that, if the time and temperature are not correct there will be a blue hue on the mug in areas that are not covered by the wrap or paper (i.e. on the handle and underneath it).

There are a few things you can do to combat this, firstly, I never have more than 0.5mm over hanging on my bleed, there is no need to have any more. Secondly, and this is vital, time and temperature are essential to get good mugs. Too hot and you will get gassing, not enough time and you will get faded spots, too hot and too long and your blacks are brown.

With my set up (Ink Tec Ink, Listawood Mugs, Tru Pix paper, Blizard oven) I find that 24 mugs are done in 18 minutes (once the oven is warmed up). I take them out, put a new set in, sometimes I take the wraps off straight away, sometimes I leave it to do something else. That is why temperature is key, my mugs stop cooking after about 5 seconds from being taken out of the oven because I have the temperature inside the oven set exactly right.

If you have it too high (oven or mug press), when you remove the mug the temperature of the mug (while dropping in temp) will still be high enough for dye sub ink to be "gassy" therefor meaning that while you are moving the mug around it is still printing.

There is nothing to stop you having a higher temperature and quicker time (I will give you an example below), you just need to be aware that higher temps means a higher risk of gassing.

I print high vis vests. The workers are paid per garment, one of my guys likes the heat press at 190 degrees and 25 seconds and rattles through the vests. He is brilliant and very very quick on removing the paper when the heat press beeps. However the risk of gassing at that temp is high, most of my guys prefer to work at 172 degrees and 45 seconds, the vests are easier to handle and there is virtually zero gassing risk when the heat press beeps. Both times and temp achieve exactly the same deep black.

I hope that explains it well enough for peeps to understand, but if not please ask and I will try and explain it better.

[Earl Smith]

Yes, that is the oven I have.

Gassing is an issue no matter what method of printing you use. In actual fact, it is probably more of a problem using ovens and wraps than it is using a mug press. Gassing basically occurs when there is too much excess ink. I will do my best to explain but it is quite complicated and I am not the best at explaining things :-) ....

As we know, dye sub ink turns into a gas during the printing process, this is why the image must be tight on the surface it is being printed to. If we want to bleed an image off the top and bottom of the mug you have to make the image bigger than the mug. Most people will make the mistake of giving 5mm top and bottom. All that excess ink turns into a gas and needs somewhere to go which is why you will find that, if the time and temperature are not correct there will be a blue hue on the mug in areas that are not covered by the wrap or paper (i.e. on the handle and underneath it).

There are a few things you can do to combat this, firstly, I never have more than 0.5mm over hanging on my bleed, there is no need to have any more. Secondly, and this is vital, time and temperature are essential to get good mugs. Too hot and you will get gassing, not enough time and you will get faded spots, too hot and too long and your blacks are brown.

With my set up (Ink Tec Ink, Listawood Mugs, Tru Pix paper, Blizard oven) I find that 24 mugs are done in 18 minutes (once the oven is warmed up). I take them out, put a new set in, sometimes I take the wraps off straight away, sometimes I leave it to do something else. That is why temperature is key, my mugs stop cooking after about 5 seconds from being taken out of the oven because I have the temperature inside the oven set exactly right.

If you have it too high (oven or mug press), when you remove the mug the temperature of the mug (while dropping in temp) will still be high enough for dye sub ink to be "gassy" therefor meaning that while you are moving the mug around it is still printing.

There is nothing to stop you having a higher temperature and quicker time (I will give you an example below), you just need to be aware that higher temps means a higher risk of gassing.

I print high vis vests. The workers are paid per garment, one of my guys likes the heat press at 190 degrees and 25 seconds and rattles through the vests. He is brilliant and very very quick on removing the paper when the heat press beeps. However the risk of gassing at that temp is high, most of my guys prefer to work at 172 degrees and 45 seconds, the vests are easier to handle and there is virtually zero gassing risk when the heat press beeps. Both times and temp achieve exactly the same deep black.

I hope that explains it well enough for peeps to understand, but if not please ask and I will try and explain it better.

Thanks Socialgiraffe. Some very interesting information.

[greenroom]

Thanks so much - that's made the principle really clear to apply to everything, not just mugs

So a decent oven thermometer is going to be my new best friend!

[UK Printed Mugs]

Well we decided what the heck and bought a 3D vacuum oven (ST3042) and literally just used it for the first time. Put 12 mugs in and instructions were rubbish so had to play around with times but after taking two mugs out at 8 mins (which it said was correct for 12 mugs - RUBBISH!), 12 mins and 16 minutes then concluded that 16 minutes at 190c (using Sawgrass ink) mugs were AMAZING!!!! Certainly will be using this for large orders of full coverage mugs. Less than 10 we would use our bank of Adkins. Good olde Amazon Warehouse deals :-)

[carolm1a]

Well we decided what the heck and bought a 3D vacuum oven (ST3042) and literally just used it for the first time. Put 12 mugs in and instructions were rubbish so had to play around with times but after taking two mugs out at 8 mins (which it said was correct for 12 mugs - RUBBISH!), 12 mins and 16 minutes then concluded that 16 minutes at 190c (using Sawgrass ink) mugs were AMAZING!!!! Certainly will be using this for large orders of full coverage mugs. Less than 10 we would use our bank of Adkins. Good olde Amazon Warehouse deals :-)

What would you say for 2 mugs? I normally only do 2 at a time and ive been doing 8 mins but just recently the results have been horrible :(

[UK Printed Mugs]

Having only used it for 16 minutes I cannot comment on times BUT I would say the oven is overkill for two mugs. Better to get a decent mug press if you're doing a small handful of mugs.

[carolm1a]

Having only used it for 16 minutes I cannot comment on times BUT I would say the oven is overkill for two mugs. Better to get a decent mug press if you're doing a small handful of mugs.

I bought it included with some other things so, apart from a little 3d oven (which I hate with a vengeance), this is our only option at the minute LOL