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View Full Version : Basic question - Which ink for transfers?



Sweetchuck87
24-01-2011, 03:31 PM
Hi, I am about to start doing t-shirt transfers for sale to the public but as yet I have no experience with it.

I have an epson D120 printer, can I use its standard ink (DuraBrite Ultra) to print a good quality t-shirt? Using standard transfer paper? I would need it to wash at least 5 times with no issues.

I have heard of using sublimation ink and sublimation transfer paper but is that unnecessary? I hope so as i'm looking to keep the costs down.

Any input would be great!

AdamB
24-01-2011, 05:39 PM
Hi, I am about to start doing t-shirt transfers for sale to the public but as yet I have no experience with it.....

No offence - but perhaps you do a little more research before you start offering to the general public? There's loads of info on the forum (use the search facility with key-words) that will make some great reading of past questions (similar to yours).

A question though, if you are about to sell these transfers to the general public, what guarantees have you that they will last a couple of washes? I only ask as there isn't a 'transfer paper' out there (to my knowledge and I would love to be proved wrong) that will last with the garment.

bms
24-01-2011, 05:54 PM
I have an epson D120 printer, can I use its standard ink (DuraBrite Ultra) to print a good quality t-shirt? Using standard transfer paper? I would need it to wash at least 5 times with no issues.

Using the genuine Epson durabright ink you can print directly onto printable flex which is washable. Further details at:
http://www.printerowners.co.uk/garment-printing/561/printable-flex.htm

Sweetchuck87
24-01-2011, 09:30 PM
I'm trying to figure what all I need to buy to do some trial runs, and then offer the service from there once I reckon I can do it properly.
I had got a couple made up from the local guy that does stag shirts etc but on the first wash they faded. I then went to another local fellow who told me he was using transfer paper and epson printer, and he did the whole thing in front of me. I have washed his samples about 6 times and they're perfect, he said the other chap was probably using old outdated transfer paper as its came a long way recently.

Maybe he was over-simplifying the procedure(as I am new to it) and was in fact using flex. All I know is he put a piece of rubbery paper in the printer, then pressed it into the shirt on his heat press, and I hoped I could do something similar.

mrs maggot
24-01-2011, 10:11 PM
are you looking to sell them as the transfers ? or as the finished article ? if they are for the home press market have you thought of the following;

what happens when they just wont stick (wrong time temp fabric - not your fault)
burn their garments (wrong time temp fabric - not your fault)

if you managed to get them done in two places locally, how is your business going to differ from theirs, apart from not having overheads if you are working from home as a spare time business, while they have rates, insurance etc to pay for ?

DREAMGLASS
24-01-2011, 10:27 PM
I would need it to wash at least 5 times with no issues.Any input would be great!
What happens after the garment has been washed after just five times, do they just scrap the garment it is attached to? Five washes could occur in as little as two weeks.

Sweetchuck87
24-01-2011, 10:29 PM
I want to sell the t shirt as a finished piece. I hope to supply local shops with souvenirs for tourists as i feel its lacking in my area, and my brother is an artist and has done a few designs for me in photoshop. As the end customer could be paying a tenner for the shirt it needs to be decent quality. Do you think printable flex is what I should use?

mrs maggot
25-01-2011, 08:43 AM
aaah, so you want to start printing t shirts, not selling transfers, now it depends on how complex your designs are and what budget for equipment you have, it might be easier to start with to outsource your printing to someone who does DTG (direct to garment) if they are very colourful or screenprints for just one or 2 solours - member stitch-up on here has and does both. so an idea of the design would help, but i think outsourcing will be the best way to go

Sweetchuck87
25-01-2011, 03:58 PM
According to LoveCut, transfer paper should do me fine:

Ink Jet Transfers have come on a long way over the last couple of years, The once poorly produced transfers are a thing of the past, with the correct knowledge and right equipment a ink jet transfer should last around 50 washes.

Here at LoveCut we only recommend epson printers as our transfer paper is designed to give best results with epsons Durabrite inks or our own brand lovebrite inks.

So I don't need printable flex after all?

John G
25-01-2011, 04:07 PM
ink jet transfer should last around 50 washes.

They also say their mugs are dishwasher safe/proof too! :rolleyes: :wink: :smile:

AdamB
25-01-2011, 04:22 PM
Classic John!

mrs maggot
25-01-2011, 10:21 PM
Sweetchuck, if you have all the answers that lovecut are giving you - then you have no need of a forum like this, where people help people by giving them genuine advice based on the pro's and cons (no pun intended) of products.

- 50 washes for a t shirt, open your drawer look at your favourite t's how long have you had them - 50 washes is less than a year - i have customers wearing mine 3&4 years after ive made them

i do some printing with epson durabrite inks on a good quality transfer paper, and i am happy with the results, i use these for some promotional t's they never have the feel of a proper transfer, and although they last well, im sure i wont see them after years like my vinyl ones

John G
26-01-2011, 01:06 AM
I screen print onto the actual t'shirt - yes, screen print. That long ago practice (dinosaur era) that is now, just about, extinct, when the image was actually printed onto the t'shirt and actually stayed on the garment after it was washed 3 - 5 times.

I really cannot believe people on this forum would sell garments that wouldn't last more than 3 - 5 washes. This is why I suggested that this forum should be a membership ran forum - the beer money brigade are asking the same questions again - and again - and we are still giving them the bullets.

John

mrs maggot
26-01-2011, 09:55 AM
I really cannot believe people on this forum would sell garments that wouldn't last more than 3 - 5 washes. This is why I suggested that this forum should be a membership ran forum - the beer money brigade are asking the same questions again - and again - and we are still giving them the bullets.

WTF - John

100% agree John, we seem to be supporting people who are actually taking our livelyhood away from us, we don't do this for pocket money, or to pay towards a holiday, or in the hope of maybe oneday making it full time - we do this for our living

AdamB
26-01-2011, 10:41 AM
As (what I class) as quite a newbie to the forum and sublimation (been doing it for the last couple of years, but opened a shop in Novemeber 2010) I have found the help and information on the forum invaluable ........................ but, I did the decent thing and read through all the old posts and viewed many videos and tutorials to try and get a little 'clued up' with what I wanted to do.

After that, I 'believe' that some of the questions I asked were genuine and sincere.

I do a variety of products in my shop and also sell childrens clothes and accesories so we have two shops rolled into one ............... and business is still hard and I am always trying to look at something unique that will set us apart. This, however, is very hard if (after many have stated) our competitiors are selling the same items for pennies. I have to take into account the rent, electric, water, consumables, equipment, ink etc etc etc and that's just runnng the shop! I work many long nights and I'm in many early mornings as I want to make this work for both myself and my family.

Those competitors will never go away, but it does seem that the forum (and please, this is only my opinion) is becoming very repetative with the same questions and they normally come down to "I want to make some mugs and make some cash for beer" and although those individuals could be seen as 'doing nothing wrong' it's the long term effects that come into question.

I posted recently about dark t-shirts and using transfer paper. I must have spent over £50 on various methods trying and testing with multiple washes because I wanted something that was 'acceptable' to be sold. I know it's an old subject and I have read a lot about it but I was hoping in technology advancing to come accross something that 'would' be suitable (don't mention magic touch - I have fingers like bratwurst sausages).

The future ...................... I don't know, but perhaps if some 'stickies' could be made with some of the guides/posts/FAQ's it would help in repetative questions. Regarding if the forum should be a 'members only' forum - I was sitting on the fence, but I'm now heading towards the majority.

DREAMGLASS
26-01-2011, 10:46 AM
we seem to be supporting people who are actually taking our livelyhood away from us - we do this for our living
There is a whole culture out there of producing cheap and cheerful print based products, with little regard to the quality the customer finally receives. Looking at some of these seller's feedback on eBay is quite enlightening. 'Picture fell to bits after first wash', 'Print was lopsided', 'T-shirt quality awful', 'Seller sent wrong size - won't communicate'. Some of those folks are real ambassadors for the industry (not).

I don't think the solution lies in creating members only sites though, but more through educating people. Whilst many folks will continue to have zero concept of a sustainable business with happy repeat customers, some of the folks that venture onto sites like this, do want to put there name to a good quality product and build up a good business reputation for themselves. Helping those folks out is ultimately good for the industry.

AdamB
26-01-2011, 10:58 AM
Ok, why not have the forum in two parts?

The first part is viewable by all where they can introduce themselves and make a couple of posts. When their postcount gets to a specific number or when a moderator sees fit they can then see the 'members' section.

I run a couple of forums myself and this would just be a permissions setting so shouldn't be too much trouble??

An idea ......... ?

DREAMGLASS
26-01-2011, 11:13 AM
I am a moderator on a big software forum and pride myself that I have never deleted any post, even when it has been offensive, negative or against the general grain. Trouble is when you start to exclude people because they perhaps hold a different viewpoint, have different thought processes, or want to conduct their business in a different way, then you end up with a petty dictatorship based on exclusion, rather than inclusion.

If this forum is about promoting sublimation as a print process, giving assistance to those encountering practical problems and passing on useful experiences with suppliers, then by necessity it needs to remain an open and transparent facility.

AdamB
26-01-2011, 11:32 AM
Yes, but that's 'your' opinion and it's great that we can discuss subjects such as these freely. However, if a new member was required to post an introduction and advised to read a few FAQ's before being give access to the full board then perhaps this would help in the 'bone' repetative questions.

I love this forum, I think the members here have some great knowledge that I often call upon (everyone's human) and I am becoming more knowledgeable by the day - but I don't promise to be an expert (yet).

I don't think you get my point, I'm not trying to advise that the forum excludes people, just puts them on a path so they can read the basic stuff before joining and asking the same questions.

John G
26-01-2011, 11:57 AM
I can see your point Dreamglass but have to agree with Adam about the same questions being asked - It was suggested a while ago to have a FAQ stickie which would sort out all this.

DREAMGLASS
26-01-2011, 12:34 PM
I really cannot believe people on this forum would sell garments that wouldn't last more than 3 - 5 washes. This is why I suggested that this forum should be a membership ran forum - the beer money brigade are asking the same questions again
Sorry John, but that sounds more like an exclusion of people that have different perspectives on running a business. Quite how making them write an intro and reading some FAQ's would ever change their philosphy about doing things on the cheap is beyond me?

For example, on several places on my own sites, it clearly states that I don't accept cheques, but I still end up having to shed the occaisional cheque from people that choose not to read; likewise on my eBay shop it clearly states I don't accept returns for incorrectly ordered sizes as the items are made to order but I still get the odd request, even though it states in three seperate places that I don't. Therein lies the whole problem, many people simply don't READ what is put in front of them, or they choose to ignore it to suit their own purpose.

Folks will continue to ask questions about 'doing things on the cheap' on this and other forums, which will always continue to annoy people with higher production standards, but print onto tees and sublimation items is always going to attract the quick buck merchants due to its low set up costs. Lets face it, most people have an iron and an inkjet printer. A few cheap transfers from an office supplier and they are ready to have a disruptive and damaging effect on the industry.

AdamB
26-01-2011, 12:57 PM
And still .............. you're not getting the point!

You refer to your own site and that people 'still use cheques' - but you don't know how many people 'were' going to use a cheque but after reading the text they didn't!

This won't solve the problem - but help!

John G
26-01-2011, 01:26 PM
People can run their businesses anyway they choose!
I'm not getting at business men/women - what i'm getting at is we are helping people that do this for pocket/beer money who are offering inferior items. They have no overheads and don't pay taxes so they can undercut anyone that runs a legal business that does pay taxes. Due to the cheap prices being peddled by the cowboys out there, just about giving the stuff away, they are devaluing the product and in turn will wreck the chances of anybody else selling a decent item at a fair price.

It may be beyond you but if we had stickies with FAQ we might not be getting the same old questions asked again and again. If we had paid for membership we wouldn't be having this debate as people that pay for something tend to do their homework and take the business a bit more serious.

Cheers John

DREAMGLASS
26-01-2011, 01:33 PM
No Adam YOU'RE the one not getting the point.

At the moment this is an OPEN forum, to which anyone can contribute ONCE they have registered as a member of this site. I'm not sure whether Justin still manually approves new members, or whether it is an automated process with the new forum software. Nobody can post on this site WITHOUT first being registered though.

You can go on ANY forum and see the same questions repeatedly asked, as very few people appear to actually bother with doing a search first, to see if their question has been brought up before. This site also has a search facility, but if people choose not to use it and keep asking the same questions then how would you propose altering that? You can have a bright red heading for when people post a new thread suggesting they search the forums first, but very few people probably would?

There are many subjects that get brought up on here repeatedly. People wanting to report vendors selling inks that don't come from a particular manufacturer, people wanting to report traders selling 'copyright' merchandise, people slurring machinery because it comes from another country. Would I want to join a CLOSED forum to listen to that endless drivel based on jealousy and envy - no I wouldn't.

The saving grace for this forum other than it is open to everyone, is that unlike other subli sites it is UK based and more relevant to sellers in this part of the world. Start talking about making it closed in any way because you don't like the way that others do business and you really start to lose the plot of what an open forum is all about.

DREAMGLASS
26-01-2011, 01:50 PM
It may be beyond you but if we had stickies with FAQ we might not be getting the same old questions asked again and again. If we had paid for membership we wouldn't be having this debate as people that pay for something tend to do their homework and take the business a bit more serious.
Rather than bitching about what everyone else is doing (or isn't) a lot of folks would do better to concentrate on what they are doing with their own enterprises. You differentiate your products from those of your competitors by offering a better product or service. There are always going to be those that attempt to undercut you in any business, if they want to be the 'busy fools' working for next to nothing, then let them.

As regards paid membership, that would only really ever work if you had some benefit to members, such as a discount arrangement with certain suppliers, or a group insurance scheme to cover small businesses.

AdamB
26-01-2011, 02:22 PM
You know what Dreamglass, I don't think I'll bother commenting on this anymore after this. I'd rather not go tit for tat in what is now turning into a (yet again) disection of posts with quotes.

If only you realised that I am merely offering some advise as help for the forum (my opinion) - whether it works or not is not for you or I to decide as we'll never know (unless someone comments that they found a particular FAQ useful). I won't say it's the right thing to do or the wrong thing to do but I am suggesting something that may help (or may not).

I could go on and on, but I haven't got the time - sorry, what I feel started as an interesting debate has now turned into something that I'd rather avoid!

John G
26-01-2011, 02:26 PM
:smile: Think we've gone off topic a little :smile:

To answer the original question - I've never used inkjet transfer paper but I have tested various laser print paper for light shirts. It has its uses and I would definitely offer it to customers wishing to have a photo printed onto a use once or twice t'shirt, such as for hen/stag nights. I did a test print on a white shirt then washed it to check quality - it looked a little faded, this could have been down to temp settings though!

As said above - it has its purpose, hope you get your answers regarding inkjet transfers.

Sweetchuck87
26-01-2011, 03:09 PM
My first post's coming under heavy fire! I simply want to get my souvenirs into the local tourist shops, i have no love for sublimation or other printing as i only heard of it when i tried to find out how to get the things made. You'll know the costs involved with screen printing, and my designs wouldn't work if i reduce them to 4 or 5 colours. Printable flex is £42+del for 25 a4 sheets, add £1 for the shirt you're printing on and consider the shop'll want to sell for a tenner. They'll then offer me £5 for it, and as you can see when you throw in the ink costs and diesel and i've not much left over. Hence i'm looking for the cheapest way of making a decent shirt.

I knew it was a basic question, i just wanted to make sure before i threw money around. Under the transfers section there is only one other topic, and i looked through the stickies to make sure. It seemed to only way to make sure i'm buying the right things was to ask, but if its a big problem feel free to delete this thread and my profile, and i'll go join t-shirt forum.

John G
26-01-2011, 03:25 PM
Hi Sweetchuck87
Flex @ around £1.88 inc. for an A4 sheet, £1 for a shirt and anything between 10 - 50p for ink that comes to a maximum of £3.38 making a £1.62 profit if sold to a 3rd party (souvenir shop) for £5.00.
Theres not a lot of profit there but sell direct to the public at shop prices (quoted £10) and there's a profit of £6.62 off a cheap t'shirt that cost you £1.00 - fantastic mark up!

Can you not open a stall or spend on a really good website and advertise your services that way.