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View Full Version : R285 - and a hell of alot of Ink!



Traynor26
10-01-2010, 09:59 PM
Hi all

My mug press has arrived and I have just been offered the following;

R285 printer + CISS
800ml of each colour (six colours)

addmitadly, the ink is from china but he says that he has been printing fine with it and has showed me some of his mugs. The bonus is, he live 3 miles away and he wants £200 for the lot cause he just wants shot.......

My intention would be to maybe get this, earn some money and then purchase some decent ink??

So it's over to you lot for some advice,

John G
10-01-2010, 10:02 PM
Get him to print a mug infront of you and take the mug home to do a wash test. If after its been handwashed and then been put through the dish washer its OK - then it seems to be a good deal.

Cheers John

purpledragon
10-01-2010, 11:58 PM
285 is a bloody good printer i miss mine since it had its identity crisis (it now thinks its a 270). But id steer clear of cheap inks but thats just me. what you need to know is how much printing has the printer done. has the chip been reset ?
brett

JSR
11-01-2010, 12:19 AM
purpledragon and John G both make good points - particularly the one about how much printing has been done.

800ml of each ink is something like the equivalent of a 100 OEM cartridges of each colour. If he's been using this kind of quantity, the waste pad has got to be pretty full. For an A4 printer, that could be a problem really quickly unless the waste tube has been diverted.

Still, if it'll cost just £200 and you can make more than £200 out of it before it goes kaput, you're quids-in. I wouldn't use inks from China myself, but you can only lose £200 at most from the deal. Might be worth the gamble.

Paul
11-01-2010, 07:30 PM
I would risk mate :)

Traynor26
12-01-2010, 08:51 PM
Hi all,

just thought i would update you, I TOOK THE PLUNGE!!........went and picked it all up today. so i got the R285, CIS and because i picked it up in person we saved the ink that was in the CIS, so i have nearly a Litre of each colour.............all for £200!!

Only problem is, i got a brand new D120 delivered today and a second hand D88 arriving tomorrow................oh well, at least i have a back up....or 2!!

took on board all your comments about the ink, but if i can get as good a results as he did (see photos) ill be over the moon,

shame i cant experiment til next week though.........im on 'Family time' at the moment,

Thanks for all your help, standy by for some daft questions next week!!

http://i14.servimg.com/u/f14/14/74/39/39/bespok13.jpg (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=4&u=14743939)

http://i14.servimg.com/u/f14/14/74/39/39/bespok14.jpg (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=5&u=14743939)

John G
12-01-2010, 09:38 PM
Mugs look good - nice bargain, ink will last you years :D

Cheers John

Paul
13-01-2010, 10:07 AM
i would investe 20 quid and get mcustom ICC made for you printers. so your prints will look perfect. :)

Andrew
18-01-2010, 06:01 PM
Surprised no one mentioned the legalities of using unlicensed ink. Just don't tell to many people as it is not exactly legite ;)

Paul
18-01-2010, 08:22 PM
I am sure it is legal to use unlicensed ink :) is illegal to sell it ;)

Traynor26
18-01-2010, 08:22 PM
Am I missing something?? Is there such a thing as 'illegal' Ink??........am I being completly niave?

Paul
18-01-2010, 08:23 PM
Am I missing something?? Is there such a thing as 'illegal' Ink??........am I being completly niave?
sort of :) sawgrass hold the patent for small format printing :)

Andrew
18-01-2010, 08:51 PM
totally illegal to use it as far as I am aware...... but that is not to say that it's not common place. Sawgrass hold the patent for all small format sublimation which means unless it is licensed by Sawgrass they can come after you. I have never heard of this happening to hobbyists but wouldn't broadcast the fact if you don't use the correct ink.

As for me, I always use the correct ink and would never consider ripping of a lovely company like Sawgrass as I enjoy being shafted by their pricing monopoly ;)

Traynor26
18-01-2010, 09:42 PM
Every day is a school day eh :shock:

JSR
19-01-2010, 01:54 AM
totally illegal to use it as far as I am aware...... but that is not to say that it's not common place. Sawgrass hold the patent for all small format sublimation which means unless it is licensed by Sawgrass they can come after you. I have never heard of this happening to hobbyists but wouldn't broadcast the fact if you don't use the correct ink.
This is an area for legal people as we can all interpret it differently.

My understanding is that the patent covers the ink designed for a particular process (which is actually for thermal printers - not micro-piezo ones - go figure). The patent holder can go after anyone who infringes that patent. The end-user is not infringing the patent, the manufacturer is.

Anyone who's been doing sublimation for a few years wouldn't risk their business on non-Sawgrass ink for one very obvious reason. Sawgrass have spent considerable time and money closing down patent-infringers. If you've invested a lot of time, money, and effort setting up your business based on a non-Sawgrass ink, there is a very real possibility that, once you run out of one colour, you won't be able to get any more. Then you'll have to change to Sawgrass anyway.

In the instance of the OP, all that's happening is that he's taking a bunch of stuff off an ex-user and that bundle includes ink. Once the ink has gone, it's down to his conscience whether he seeks out more of the stuff (if it's available) or if he goes down the Sawgrass route.

I can't see Sawgrass knocking on his door and having a wobbly, but I can see them finding out who makes the ink and shutting them down - who knows, maybe they've already been shut down? Either way, the availability of the ink will be very limited.


As for me, I always use the correct ink and would never consider ripping of a lovely company like Sawgrass as I enjoy being shafted by their pricing monopoly ;)
There are ways to avoid this. Buy ink in large quantities for price savings. Or buy a large format printer - then you can (legally) buy anyone's sublimation ink. Sawgrass' patent is only valid for desktop printers, not large format ones.

Personally, as much as I don't like Sawgrass' inflated prices, it's still signficantly cheaper than OEM ink - so it could be worse. ;) I'll stick with my Artanium, thanks all the same.

Andrew
19-01-2010, 11:55 AM
As far as I am aware and I have discussed this on several occasions on other forums, Sawgrass have it tied down securely and cover all small format dyesub printing. The last company which was fighting it's corner was TOG (Texas) who eventually caved in and sold out after declaring they would fight Sawgrass to the end.

There are other suppliers like Lyson who have equally as good ink as Sawgrass and sell vast quantities to the trade but for wide format printers. I swapped to a wide format printer a couple of years ago and now buy exactly the same Artainium ink but at 25% of the cost. If I was to use this ink in one of my smaller printers even though having bought it legally for wide format, then Sawgrass could fine me. Sawgrass have a monopoly to print money where the smaller guys are concerned. If they didn't inflate the ink so much then they wouldn't have the problem.

To the OP, I would carry on with what you have bought without worrying but just be aware not to mention to openly where Sawgrass might be lurking.

Good luck with getting started.

JSR
19-01-2010, 01:03 PM
I swapped to a wide format printer a couple of years ago and now buy exactly the same Artainium ink but at 25% of the cost. If I was to use this ink in one of my smaller printers even though having bought it legally for wide format, then Sawgrass could fine me.
Clearly you've had more dealings here than I have so I don't dispute your claim, however this seems to make about as much sense as a chocolate fireguard.

You're effectively saying that, if you have two printers (one large format, and one small format for backup purposes) and you buy in litres of the cheap Artanium for the large format printer, that you can't use that ink in the small format one? You actually have to buy "25% cost Artanium" and "100% cost Artanium", and keep track of which one you use in which printer just on the off-chance Sawgrass throw their rattles out of their pram?

That's about the most barmy thing I've ever heard. :lol:

If you inadvertently put "25% cost Artanium" in the small-format printer, does everyone have coronaries until you've cleaned it out, chucked it all away, and put "100% cost Artanium" in there instead? :shock:

Andrew
19-01-2010, 01:17 PM
JSR - totally agree with you and I could rant all day about it. It is completely stupid but this is how they make their money as they have created their own monopoly. If I wanted to run a one of my R1800's to go along with my 9000 yes I should really be purchasing 2 seperate lots of exactly the same ink with the 1800 ink costing 4 times the cost that tops up the Sawgrass slush fund. I just stick to wide format and buy Artainium in 1ltrs for the same price as what I used to buy 250ml. A ltr only lasts a month or 2 so is more convenient anyway.

The printer that I heard about who was caught using non Sawgrass ink was fined by them supposedly going through his invoices and calculating how much ink he used then working out the real cost.

It's a bit like telling a tea drinker they have to pay 4 times more for 1 of our mugs than a coffee drinker.

Jason Davies
07-02-2010, 08:53 PM
OP you had a very good deal there, three of us imported equipment from China to dip our toes in about 12 months ago, it was a very interesting experience. Very good service and the products were pretty good. The inks you have are excellent and print to a very high standard, we did quite a bit of research around the quality before we committed.
Hope you enjoy.
Jase

y30man5
15-02-2010, 08:12 PM
Is there an Artainium CISS system for the R285?

purpledragon
18-02-2010, 10:14 AM
yes there is i have one myself though unfortunatly i dont have the 285 anymore
Brett

bms
18-02-2010, 11:29 AM
Latest product listing from Sawgrass doesn't list an Easyflow system for the R265 or R285 anymore.

Karen.
21-02-2010, 11:18 AM
Is it only me - I have had sample mugs from 4 different people over years who are not using Sawgrass and the colours are out on every single one of them - usually the yellow and/or blue. My parents had a sample sent last week by someone trying to sell them mugs - it was awful - the yellow was not the right colour and the image was all stretched out of shape (ok, so that part s nothing to do with the inks). Just wondering if those who sell these items actually realise just how out the colours are?

Paul
21-02-2010, 02:07 PM
I used sawgrass and non sawgrass ink before and in both colors was not 100% accurate. they was close enough but not 100%.
I had some problems with yellow as well and it was with sawgrass ink and sawgrass ICC. So I dont know if it was my monitor nedded calibration or there is just not possible to have 100% acurate colors in sublimation printing.