Digital Backgrounds

[Justin]

I've been looking at digital backgrounds on eBay and wondered if anyone had any thoughts on these? Looking at ways to liven up photo's for printing onto a multitude of blanks, bags, panels etc.

Couple of examples to show what I mean:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ULTIMATE-DIGITAL-PHOTO-BACKGROUNDS-PHOTOSHOP-TEMPLATE-/150440801166?pt=US_Photography_Background_Material&hash=item2306f8738e#ht_13192wt_1136

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DIGITAL-BACKGROUNDS-FANTASY-KIDS-BACKDROPS-PROPS-FLOWERS-BABY-GREEN-SCREEN-/300694329145?pt=US_Photography_Background_Material&hash=item4602c75739#ht_10469wt_1180

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2400-pro-Hi-res-digital-backdrops-backgrounds-for-photoshop-cs-ect-2-DVD-set-/150897325061?pt=UK_Computing_Software_Software_SR&hash=item23222e7405#ht_11899wt_1136

Appreciate any feedback/advice on this :-)

[WorthDoingRight]

Well you can never have too many backgrounds and they do not seem too expensive in relative terms.

[Ian M]

Justin, the first one looks good as it has so many things you could use. The second one does look a bit cheap & tacky when you look at the sample images, they do look like someone has just stuck something on a background. The third one have a look at the other items they have because there does seem to be some nice things you could use. I would probably go for the first one as it has so many things to offer.

[Justin]

Yeah, the first one I was most interested in, they also do this one http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/THE-ULTIMATE-DIGITAL-BACKGROUNDS-PRO-PACKAGE-PLUS-/190377449416?pt=US_Photography_Background_Material&hash=item2c536157c8#ht_14133wt_1136 which is a larger collection. I do like the look of some opf the other ones on the third link as well :-)

As with mug templates, the problem isn't coming up with something nice, it's getting the customer to accept it when all they seem to want to do is plonk a basic photo in the middle of a blank! :-(

[GoldRapt]

So, are these imported in photoshop and your own stuff goes on top and then gets printed?

[Justin]

That's kind of the idea, just something to put behind basic photo's, enhance etc.

[Paul]

They all look good. I dont know your skill level in ps but to make it look real you need some GOOD knowledge of ps an basics of.lighting. Even with some good.portrait on chroma key background its dificult...

[Ian M]

Yeah, the first one I was most interested in, they also do this one http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/THE-ULTIMATE-DIGITAL-BACKGROUNDS-PRO-PACKAGE-PLUS-/190377449416?pt=US_Photography_Background_Material&hash=item2c536157c8#ht_14133wt_1136 which is a larger collection. I do like the look of some opf the other ones on the third link as well :-)

As with mug templates, the problem isn't coming up with something nice, it's getting the customer to accept it when all they seem to want to do is plonk a basic photo in the middle of a blank! :-(

Justin, I also saw the other one & thought that was better. I also found they have a few basic tutorials on You Tube which shows how to use & blend the backgrounds.

I know what you mean with trying to get the customer to accept something different & have found if you have a couple of samples for them to look at they soon come round to your way of thinking.

[Justin]

Just having a play around with some free backgrounds, sourced from this site http://lostandtaken.com/ and they seem to work well. My concern is the time spent on each image getting it to look half decent but so far so good :-)

Appreciate everyone's feedback on the packages, I may well go for the larger pack.

Ian, I'll check out the YouTube tutorials thank you.

[Russ]

Personally, I can understand customers reluctance to "to accept it when all they seem to want to do is plonk a basic photo in the middle of a blank! :-(" Surely they want the person's image to be the star, not the editing skills of the supplier; the skills are there when they aren't evident.

I agree something has to be done to make it a unique, customised product, so how about starting with simple framing ideas? A drop-shadow square, the subject 'holding' a wooden frame with legs appearing below? The various backgrounds have all got their place, but try to create a piece of art, instead of cheese... #tuppencechuckedinthemix

[Justin]

You're absolutely right Russ and I would always want to ensure that the photo of their nearest and dearest is the focal point of any print, the frame needs to enhance this and not detract but I find nothing worse than a passport sized photograph appearing on the front and back of a mug. A simple drop shadow can make all the difference but sometimes I think you need more.

[JMugs]

Ahhhh thats the point isn't it " but sometimes I think you need more".

25 years of working for myself and I now work on the basis that I know nothing! The client says, I do, client happy, I'm paid. Less hassle, and I like less hassle.

Now if I was working with an Arty Farty client base with pots of cash that would be different. Some of the examples in the links you posted would deserve big money, and good skills. Out of my league, but a good one to get in if you can!

I hasten to add my 25 years self employed have not been in this line of work and therefore I could well be talking a load of Westcountry Bollocks!.

Janners

[Justin]

Yeah, you're talking Bollocks Janners but if I put a tongue in cheek smiley here I can get away with saying that.

[Justin]

:tongue: There ya go!

[phoenixalpha]

I totally agree.... I've been a Graphic Designer now for 2 decades or so. The customer is always right even when they are dead wrong.

It's they who pay your wages and even if they want a pile of crap then thats what they want. I've learned over the years that you can come up with the best design ever known to mankind, but if the customer wants a stock logo of their company in reflex blue and Times New Roman, then thats what they want and they wont change their minds. Everyone has an opinion on design, even if its out their backside and completely wrong but they are the ones paying the money for your work. If its crap they want, I'd suggest a couple of alternatives instead, but if they dont want to take my advice - its their money that they are spending so who am I to say otherwise.

If a customer comes to me with a picture taken on their phone which is postage stamp sized and they want that "kids writing style of writing" (ie comic sans) - I would say that perhaps the image wont reproduce well as its such a small size and I would recommend another typeface, unless of course they do want it to look that bad, but if the customer wants that... well then I'd do my best to ensure my customer walks away at the end of the day happy with one of my products.

[Justin]

So your customer walks away with a poorly printed products, poor quality logo etc. What happens with word of mouth? Who printed that for you, it's crap...who designed that for you, it's amateur....I won't be using them then. I know printers who flatly refuse to send anything out sub standard, I also know printers who will produce anything as long as they get paid.

It's an interesting debate.

[Russ]

Sometimes they will need steering in the right direction - that's when you may have to throw some 'image resolution ' 'reproduction issues' comments in ( so long as you know what you're talking about :-) )

[Justin]

OK, example of what I'm talking about. I have this image ...
1209

Produced on a white background and has been cropped square as you can see. Printed front and back on a mug, printed in the middle of a jigsaw puzzle and so on. Without a background to extend the image would get lost on the white unprinted area.

What would you suggest here?

[phoenixalpha]

So your customer walks away with a poorly printed products, poor quality logo etc. What happens with word of mouth? Who printed that for you, it's crap...who designed that for you, it's amateur....I won't be using them then. I know printers who flatly refuse to send anything out sub standard, I also know printers who will produce anything as long as they get paid.

It's an interesting debate.

Anything I send out is of the highest and best quality I can make it, but if the customer wants crap, supplies crap, then the only thing coming out the other side is crap too. So if a customer comes in with a small photo of her daughter, its the only one she has, would you turn her away? Do you turn away work that you personally dislike? I deal with a lot of customers who have the worst kind of design work done (its done in Word, Publisher, 4 colour black text, images in RGB or at 72dpi, or ripped off a website with the copyright still watermarked on them - the list goes on and on and I'm not talking small backstreet companies. Even big multinational companies that I've worked with in the past have been guilty of these).

You as a designer/printer/whatever do the best of your own abilities to make it look good and a quality product but its what you get in and the customers attitude/finances/limitations that dictate what is achievable.

[Justin]

Sometimes they will need steering in the right direction - that's when you may have to throw some 'image resolution ' 'reproduction issues' comments in ( so long as you know what you're talking about :-) )

Isn't this the same as I? lol.

Resolution isn't the issue here but I appreciate that can be a problem. The problem is getting the image to look decent on different blanks.

[phoenixalpha]

that image there, Justin. If it was a sufficient enough quality for a decent enough reproduction - dependant on timescales here (ten minute max I'd say) - I'd take out the backdrop, put in a complimentary colour with a bit of gradient fade to make it look a lot better, clone in his elbow and extend the image out side and bottom to give enough to fill the image and give you some bleed so that the image bleeds off making it look halfway decent.

Show the customer their artwork plonked in the middle of a jigsaw and *my* version. If they dont want my version, they get their own version as they asked for. I'd try my best but if the customer wants something else, then its their call.

[Justin]

Yeah, that's basically what I've done. I added a solid background but the harsh squared edges don't help. I changed the background to something a little more subtle and personally I think it works better. I can also then change the shape to fit any blank. Problem is, as I get these images I don't want to be spending too much time on them so it's getting the right balance.

[phoenixalpha]

Thats why I was saying with time and financial constraints. If you dont have the time all those 5-10 minute jobs wont be cost effective to you. The bottom line is if you have the time to spare, go for it. If you dont the customer is unlikely to recompense you for your effort.

[Justin]

Yes, that's the balance. If everything could go onto the same background and edited quickly it's not a problem :-)

[Russ]

If you use software that accepts layers, you could make the background as big as the largest product, then Place the subject in a separate layer. Crop the big image for each product?
I only do mugs (so far) so not sure if what I'm saying makes sense for other products.

[ASLCreative]

The best way to convince a customer about quality issues is to show them actual examples of "poor" and "good" photos on printed products

Likewise do the same for backgrounds - with and without a plain white background.

[Justin]

OK, update on this, customer wants white background leaving as it is so I have to run with that. White onto white blanks, never mind :-(

[Russ]

Oh well - high key shots are in vogue, looking in photographers window displays shows a number of these type of shots.

[phoenixalpha]

What you did is what I would've done and it's the best you can hope for but as I said... the customer is always right.

Do it, forget about it, move on to the next one. I've seen your work and it's spot on and that more than most can say.

[Paul]

There os nothing wrong with photo with white bacground printed n white blank. If photo is highh resolution this can look nice and clean.

Ohhh.. Only coz.someone is photographe on white background not mean its high key :-)

[Justin]

Oh well, stick a small portrait image onto a large landscape product it is then :-( lol. I'll keep looking for a magical way to get these images to fill the space!

My work phoenixalpha?

[Justin]

There os nothing wrong with photo with white background printed n white blank. If photo is high resolution this can look nice and clean.

Hear what you're saying Paul, it's just this particular image has squared off edges and doesn't lend itself to landscape products unless I zoom in.

[Paul]

Sometimes to fill the space i use quotes. Looks great with kids photos. I rekember my friend wanted horizontal printed slate with photo tyat was good quality but not to good for this slate. I added quote and empty space was filled. :-)

[Russ]

Meant the style is similar to high key, Paul.

[Justin]

Could be an option Paul, there has to be something better than just plonking the image in the centre :-( Second use of the word plonking today!

[Paul]

Put this pic righ to the side so.squere sides are right to the side. And use empty space to put some.nice wording that fit the person or image...
here is little example of my work with quotes:
http://www.mediafire.com/conv/01e46cc4f57c130f908bb8b0dd001e6a149f38e3d95503a752 401e7362b4b9e46g.jpg

http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/280375_230093830346416_5288947_o.jpg


http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/465132_422948684394262_1497286046_o.jpg\\

[Justin]

These are lovely Paul (and I will be coming to you when I start a different line of work soon!) but the instruction I'm getting is just to print the image with nothing else next to it....I may have to find a suitable compromise though.

[Paul]

Is school/company/photographer logo can be included???

[Justin]

Would be a great idea to add logos Paul but not possible I don't think :-(

[socialgiraffe]

Although I have nothing against backgrounds I would have some concerns that have been raised.

Firstly IANM is right in that getting these images to look spot on will require quite a bit of PS skill. I have visions of someone coming in with a picture from an iPhone and saying I want it to look like that one you have of a magazine front cover, and as you already mentioned, to make it look spot on could easily take an hour of friggin around. Who will pay the £200.00 per hour you charge LOL!!!

That said, at US$50.00 for the larger libarary, its not really much money for the options it adds.

I say go for it, then if you find you do not use them I will give you US$10 for the used CD :-)

[WorthDoingRight]

9 times out of 10 any CD or DVD sold on eBay is full of images/fonts/designs from the public domain repackaged for a profit. So if that is the case Simon we can offer Justin $1 each for a copy lol