Copyright theft and damages

[Matt Quinn]

You've probably come across the Cobis/Getty/ J.A. Coles fiasco Garry...

Rather than go to via a local solicitor, no matter how posh, you really need an I.P. specialist...

Charles Swann... http://www.swanturton.com/ One of the UK's top IP specilists; more accessible than you'd imagine!

FWIW We send out a warning letter by recorded delivery giving them 14 days to 'take down' the material after which we will be instructing a solicitor to asert our rights and financial interests,the cost of which will be sought from the infringer...

Then we do just that! Raising an action for costs! Usually winds up settled out of court with an Non Disclosure Agreement.

[GoonerGary]

Yes I've been interested in that, especially the retrospective licence. I had a client who scammed me out of paying an invoice for photography work. Out of interest, I asked for a copy of their brochure and found one of my images printed in it. That will be another legal letter. I could make a better living pursuing the people who are robbing me.

http://copyrightaction.org/forum/getty- ... ins?page=2

£2000 plus legal expenses for a single stock image? Not a bad payday.

[JSR]

Yes I've been interested in that, especially the retrospective licence. I had a who client scammed me out of paying an invoice for photography work. Out of interest, I asked for a copy of their brochure and found one of my images printed in it. That will be another legal letter. I could make a better living pursuing the people who are robbing me.

http://copyrightaction.org/forum/getty- ... ins?page=2

£2000 plus legal expenses for a single stock image? Not a bad payday.

Just because they got it, that doesn't mean you will. (I hope you do though, if it goes that far.)

I don't understand those who rip-off people's photos. There are plenty of microstock sites out there that, for a few quid, you can find the image you want and use it according to their license. Why bother with the hassle of nicking someone's photo?

[Matt Quinn]

Stock images can be worth a lot more than £2K - For administrative purposes the default one-year, non-exclusive licence fee we quote for any piece of i.P. is £35K!

- A good stock image, say the famous poster of the 'tennis girl' scratching her bum, could be worth a mind-boggling sum!

Once a stock image is infringed it can be irrepairably devalued... If you were a major international bank, looking for an iconic unique shot of Hong Kong harbour in a thinderstorm say... And were prepared to pay BIG money... Well; you might be tempted to rule OUT the one that 'Sammy Chan' knocked off to slap on some mugs he's flogging down the market...

Could cost the photographer the shot of a lifetime!

But the trick here is establishing the value of the IP in the first place.

[JSR]

But the trick here is establishing the value of the IP in the first place.

That is, of course, the question. I wouldn't have thought some shyster selling mugs is all that bothered if the image is highly valued, so long as it looks nice enough to sell.

But it's different levels of ripping-off, as you say.

From my perspective, as someone who wouldn't knowingly use someone else's image without permission, I was recently on the look out for images I could use for book covers. This led me to microstock sites. I initially thought they'd be too expensive and so I'd done some fairly-rubbish covers of my own. However, to find a selection of images that I thought would suit my books perfectly, each image worked out to just a few quid. I'm considering now printing some of the finished montages to mugs, etc - at which point I pay for the appropriate license (which works out to about £35 each).

Other licenses are available, included exclusivity and sell-the-rights, and all prices are fairly affordable for what the license allows you to do. Hence my lack of understanding of those who might rip-off, for example, a wedding photo (as has been mentioned in this thread).

If someone wants a wedding photo, there's a whole raft to choose from on microstock sites that, for a few quid, you can use with a clear conscience and no threat of court action - so why not do that instead of ripping people off?

[Paul Richards]

You may win damages costs no problem , but if the person you are claiming against has no money, and most of these people are clever enough not to have any assets in their name, all you get is a very large bill from your solicitor

[Matt Quinn]

If someone wants a wedding photo, there's a whole raft to choose from on microstock sites that, for a few quid, you can use with a clear conscience and no threat of court action - so why not do that instead of ripping people off?

Sometimes it's ignorance and stupidity... Often willful igorance. Or just contempt for the law and the rights of those who create what they use...

One that made me laugh recently...

I'd sent some of my first year students out to do 'Vox Pops' in Sauchihall St... I get them for law first thing Monday morning and tech in the afternoon. So I try to 'liven up' the rather dry law stuff by making a bit of a project out of it...

Anyways... The guys came back with footage of this one muppet who proclaimed how he only EVER downloaded music from ILLEGAL sites! - Because he was trying to sell music himself and didn't want to encourage the competition!

Very quickly one of my students pointed out that if everyone did that there would be NO music industry and that he himself would never recover the money he'd invested to make his music as clearly it was Ok to rip HIM off... At which he started to waffle about 'just starting out' and being poor... and how unfair that would be!

On the visual media side of things there are some right eijits out there; many just plain old-fashioned dishonest with it...

The ones that are getting caught out are pretty much in that position because they themselves, or the people they hired, were either incompetent or dishonest. Ignorant of the law (which is no defence) or dismissive of it...

Why would anyone chose to be one of those things? - Largely because they think the rules don't apply to them!

[GoonerGary]

You may win damages costs no problem , but if the person you are claiming against has no money, and most of these people are clever enough not to have any assets in their name, all you get is a very large bill from your solicitor

Google maps shows a nice detached house and sports cars, his house is worth about half a million according to the registry. He and his wife have a number of Ltd companies registered and several top rated ebay accounts. Piracy pays.

[smitch6]

You may win damages costs no problem , but if the person you are claiming against has no money, and most of these people are clever enough not to have any assets in their name, all you get is a very large bill from your solicitor

I remember selling my window cleaning business a few yrs back (i feel off a ladder so decided to sell lol )
a really nice chap enquired about buying it and asked if he could pay by instalments, me being me said sure lol
he paid the 1st 2 or 3 no problems the next cheque bounced so i went round his house and he made some story about oh sorry wrong ac etc and gave me another cheque which cleared and from that moment it was a nightmare.
every cheque he gave me bounced, he never answered his phone or door.

he lived in a really nice house and had a huge window cleaning business, so i contacted the local court about making a small claim.
they actually knew him by name and said he's done this loads of times before and had work done for him and refused to pay the tradesmen.
they informed me that the house was his wife's not his all his business's were his wife's etc.
the court informed me i would win my case but would NEVER get the money as i would have to pay upfront for the court then pay for bailiff's who couldn't actually get anything because it was all his wife's so i would be throwing money left right and centre at this chap and still wouldn't get my money back.

he said i'd be better off forgetting about the 2K and putting it down to experience lol
nice hey how some ppl can just flout the law and get away with it, and then some of us who do the silliest thing wrong get hammered.

[GoonerGary]

The man and wife both operate Ltd companies from the same address. If I got hold of the company records and saw that both were shareholders/ directors etc, I could bring a joint claim against the two people and not the company? I'll assume they could just fold the Ltd company to avoid payment and continue to operate under one of the joint companies they own? So claiming against both people would be hard for them to evade.

According to Getty, an illustration for multiple product uses in 3 countries and 1 year licence is £4400. x2 for infringement under CDP Act, then multiply that by the number of designs stolen equates to a serious figure.