Mug Sublimation Training Workshop Required

Being new to sublimation printing I have been trying to find someone that would provide one-to-one training or workshop with my own equipment either at home or not too far within England/Wales. I have an Apple Mac running Adobe PhotoShop Elements 12 for design and image/photo manipulation and the following hardware:

• Ricoh Aficio SG 3110 DN with Sublijet R cartridges approx 60% full
• Samsung CLP 320 laser printer
• Automatic mug heat press
• 15"clam shell heat press

Along with various materials such as sublimation paper, mouse mats, aprons, mugs, iPhone cases, fridge magnets, shoulder bags, wallets and even temporary tattoo paper!

Regards,

Keith

Hi! you can lear a LOT from just reading this forum. Practicing is another great way of learning. If this is not enough then I will be happy to have a go with you if you don't mind traveling :)

Paul

Plenty of how to videos on YouTube too.
It's really not that hard

Hi Guys,

thanks for the suggestions and yes this is a fabulous forum, full of good advice and YouTube is full of tutorials but there is nothing like some structured hands-on training. I am having real trouble getting a clean, clear and bright image on my mugs and don't want to keep wasting the paper and mugs if its me doing something wrong? Found this course via Google search: http://www.sublitraining.co.uk

Cheers,


Keith

There use to be a how to dye sub dvd, I've no idea if its still available

What paper are you using?

Sublitraining (Nikki) is a member here. Xpres also offer some great in house demos, training and backup but only if you've bought equipment form them. As already mentioned, you'll find everything you need on this forum anyway ;-)

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Originally Posted by jennywren

There use to be a how to dye sub dvd, I've no idea if its still available

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Hi Jenny, that would be interesting, any idea where I could find one?

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Originally Posted by pisquee

What paper are you using?

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Hi Pisquee, The paper I have is Xpress XP4072A Sublimation Paper A4. This was recommended to me, any good?

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Originally Posted by Justin

Sublitraining (Nikki) is a member here. Xpres also offer some great in house demos, training and backup but only if you've bought equipment form them. As already mentioned, you'll find everything you need on this forum anyway ;-)

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Hi Justin, I have emailed Nikki (Nicci) this morning, so will see if she is still doing courses. I have had plenty of support and advice on this forum but still not getting the results I am looking for :-( The images on my mugs look dull and are not sharp and bright like I have seen despite trying all the things recommended on this forum so decided I must need some training or my equipment or materials are faulty? I often find that with formal training there is one thing that you are missing and once you are physically shown in a practical manner it all falls into place.

xpres i believe also will help guide you at their hq - you can lessen the wastage costs by cutting certain things up like mousemats etc, but for mugs, expect to loose a few before you get them right - take some of your printed sheets with you can see if it is your print that is at fault and also your mugs, it would help on here if you posted up images of some that you have pressed already so others can comment on them

Where did you get the mugs from?

Just print a small area of a mug, then you can use it for several tests.

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Originally Posted by mrs maggot

xpres i believe also will help guide you at their hq - you can lessen the wastage costs by cutting certain things up like mousemats etc, but for mugs, expect to loose a few before you get them right - take some of your printed sheets with you can see if it is your print that is at fault and also your mugs, it would help on here if you posted up images of some that you have pressed already so others can comment on them

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Hi Mrs Maggot (love the name and avatar), thank you for the reply. I had a loo around the xpres site "http://www.xpres.co.uk" but couldn't find any training or workshops? I have shared some images on my other thread seeking help http://www.dyesubforum.co.uk/vbforum...AC-OS-X-10-9-3

I will have a few other attempts tomorrow with different timings. What are the affects of too long or too short in the press and too high or low temperatures on the images???

Thanks again Keith

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Originally Posted by socialgiraffe

Where did you get the mugs from?

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I was recommend to BMS Limited http://www.printerowners.co.uk/subli...ation-mugs.htm this where the mugs came from.... Any good?

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Originally Posted by gorgall2

Just print a small area of a mug, then you can use it for several tests.

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Hi Gorgall2, I didn't realise you could print on a mug more than once, I assumed that the heat reaction between the mug and the print would affect the special coating???? I will try this for various temperatures and timings to see if it makes a difference? Thanks Keith



If I attach the image would anyone be willing to try and print it themselves to see what they get? Not sure how I would do that?

Hi Keith

BMS mugs are very good so that is not the problem.

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Originally Posted by socialgiraffe

Hi Keith

BMS mugs are very good so that is not the problem.

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Thanks SocialGiraffe, one thing eliminated!

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Originally Posted by Keith Coppuck

Hi Mrs Maggot (love the name and avatar), thank you for the reply. I had a loo around the xpres site "http://www.xpres.co.uk" but couldn't find any training or workshops? I have shared some images on my other thread seeking help http://www.dyesubforum.co.uk/vbforum...AC-OS-X-10-9-3

I will have a few other attempts tomorrow with different timings. What are the affects of too long or too short in the press and too high or low temperatures on the images???

Thanks again Keith



I was recommend to BMS Limited http://www.printerowners.co.uk/subli...ation-mugs.htm this where the mugs came from.... Any good?



Hi Gorgall2, I didn't realise you could print on a mug more than once, I assumed that the heat reaction between the mug and the print would affect the special coating???? I will try this for various temperatures and timings to see if it makes a difference? Thanks Keith



If I attach the image would anyone be willing to try and print it themselves to see what they get? Not sure how I would do that?

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Hi All, here's a link to my first mug. Any tips on why it's so blurred?

https://www.flickr.com/photos/222516...7644796097580/

maybe to much pressure? maybe...

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Originally Posted by Paul

maybe to much pressure? maybe...

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Hi Paul, thanks again for the help. I think I will just have to bite the bullet and waste a few sheets of paper and mugs. So:

Different temperatures
Different durations
Different pressures

The supplier (BMS) recommendation was "Press at 180 degrees Celsius for 3 minutes" http://www.printerowners.co.uk/subli...ation-mugs.htm which is what I used for this one. What is the best way to check I have the correct image and print settings?

Cheers,


Keith

You need to drop your temp down to 170c for ricoh gel ink and we all have wasted mugs and other blanks before getting our settings right lots of trial and error.
Once you've got your setting right there will be days where you'll be kicking yourself cus you've put the image on the mug upside down and the other odd silly thing but its all part of the joy of sublimation.

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Originally Posted by galerion

You need to drop your temp down to 170c for ricoh gel ink and we all have wasted mugs and other blanks before getting our settings right lots of trial and error.
Once you've got your setting right there will be days where you'll be kicking yourself cus you've put the image on the mug upside down and the other odd silly thing but its all part of the joy of sublimation.

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Many thanks "galerion" I will make my next attempt reduced pressure and at 170c. Will let you know :-)

Ok, so I have used the recommended colour test template and adjusted the heat and timings as per everyones comments and "eureka" what a result! See image below - The photo just doesn't do it justice as it was hard to get the lovely bright colours to shine through:
Attachment 2855

Now the bad news - "Appetite for Destruction"

I then created an image that I wanted to sublimate onto some mugs (the album cover from the amazing Guns and Roses "Appetite for Destruction") but the results were not good despite trying different durations and temperatures? I just don't understand why the colour test template came out so well and the GNR mugs look blurred and perhaps scorched at the bottom edge the main part of the mug looks great but its around the edges, see photos below...

Attachment 2857
Attachment 2858

Attachment 2860
Attachment 2861

Going to have to step in here,

Guns and Roses are one of my clients (or rather their European merchandiser is), you do not have copyright permission to print this mug and it is not allowed. Just like we are not allowed to assist with inks other than Sawgrass (if in small format printers), we should not be allowed to assist when you are clearly breaking copyright law.

While I am more than happy to help anyone with problems, I do not think helping people to break the law should be on that list and I personally think this should be taken as seriously as the Sawgrass patent.

Sorry if I sound a bit strong, it just bugs me at times :-)

i have the dvd copy that i got when i bought my equipment

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Originally Posted by socialgiraffe

Going to have to step in here,

Guns and Roses are one of my clients (or rather their European merchandiser is), you do not have copyright permission to print this mug and it is not allowed. Just like we are not allowed to assist with inks other than Sawgrass (if in small format printers), we should not be allowed to assist when you are clearly breaking copyright law.

While I am more than happy to help anyone with problems, I do not think helping people to break the law should be on that list and I personally think this should be taken as seriously as the Sawgrass patent.

Sorry if I sound a bit strong, it just bugs me at times :-)

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Hi Socialgiraffe,

Firstly I can assure that there is no intent to infringe any copyright. This image was just a trial, especially for the solid black background to get the printing right. In fact I am a massive Guns and Roses fan and went to see them at the NEC LG Arena in 2010 with my 18 year old son. These mugs are not for sale or distribution just the result of failed attempts to sublimate a great image with a strong background.

This is also not the market niche I am interested in so please do not be concerned.

Kind regards,

Ever Lawful and Very Aware of Copyright and Patents Keith :-)

Hi Keith

All good mate, as and I said in my other post I am sure you are a top bloke.

Glad to hear that it is a test mug, and to be fair, I have had a crappy day and instead of seeing a stack of GNR mugs I saw a bit of the old red mist. Please accept my apologies if I have offended you as it was not (and still isn't!) the case. Likewise in my rant, although the escence of it still stands, I will publicly admit that it is not directed at you in any way shape or form.

Thanks for explaining, and glad to hear you are a fan, keep buying the crappy merchandise they churn out so I can keep eating LOL!!!

Actually deleted the other post Keith...

I had an imaginary cigarette (gave up January), re-read and did not want the thread to be associated with you in any way shape or form as that would not be fair. I will wait until another crappy day and then might repost something about copyright then :-)

SG

In answer to your question, its to do with the mug base.

When you put a mug in the heat press the main body of the mug gets hot pretty quickly, but the base takes a lot longer as the immediate heat generated by the blanket is "sucked" into the base.

There are many suggestions and the one I favour and use is to use a teryaki grill to heat the mugs before putting them in the press. This helps because the base of the mug will even out to a similar temperature to the rest of the mug very quickly.

You can try things like putting them on radiators and I think someone else suggested putting boiling water in them for a few minutes.

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Originally Posted by socialgiraffe

In answer to your question, its to do with the mug base.

When you put a mug in the heat press the main body of the mug gets hot pretty quickly, but the base takes a lot longer as the immediate heat generated by the blanket is "sucked" into the base.

There are many suggestions and the one I favour and use is to use a teryaki grill to heat the mugs before putting them in the press. This helps because the base of the mug will even out to a similar temperature to the rest of the mug very quickly.

You can try things like putting them on radiators and I think someone else suggested putting boiling water in them for a few minutes.

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Hi again Socialgiraffe,

not offended in anyway you are just trying to protect the interest of your client and I respect that! In my day job I have to regularly deal with software IPR issues especially in respect of using some open source gizmos so very much understand where you are coming from.

I will experiment with some pre-heating methods hot tap water in the cup prior to pressing seems like a good solution, would I need to also reduce the press time?

I too gave up smoking 22 years ago but sometimes still after all that time fancy a piggy, especially in a beer garden with a cold beer or arriving in the middle of nowhere after a long adventurous bike ride. Don't turn back no matter what the stress or temptation :-)

Thanks again for the tip I will let you know the results.

Kind regards,

Keith

Water in the base can work but needs to be boiling hot and a bit of a faff. Personally I pre-heat the lowest inch of the mug in the press at full heat for 20/30 seconds. If you have a few to do the trays are a great idea or you can sit them on top of your flat press if you happen to be using that as well.

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Originally Posted by Justin

Water in the base can work but needs to be boiling hot and a bit of a faff. Personally I pre-heat the lowest inch of the mug in the press at full heat for 20/30 seconds. If you have a few to do the trays are a great idea or you can sit them on top of your flat press if you happen to be using that as well.

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Many thanks Justin, I will just be pleased to get a decent result with one of own images. I have a heat tray so will give that a go. Cheers Keith

In answer to your question about reducing times

That's a see what happens answer. Every press is difference and you may even find when you replace the blanket there might be some minor adjustments to be made. But if you were not happy with the initial result and you had pre warmed I would say the first port of call is a reduction in temp and time.

Hello Keith,

I had same problems like yours am wasted over 30 mugs, when i pre-heated my mug and then placed to mug press after cooking mug looks very nice, shiny, colors perfect.

And yes all thanx to DSF members, helped a lot.

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Originally Posted by socialgiraffe

In answer to your question about reducing times

That's a see what happens answer. Every press is difference and you may even find when you replace the blanket there might be some minor adjustments to be made. But if you were not happy with the initial result and you had pre warmed I would say the first port of call is a reduction in temp and time.

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Many thanks again SocialGiraffe, I will keep you posted with progress (good or bad). Cheers Keith

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Originally Posted by JustBeGood

Hello Keith,

I had same problems like yours am wasted over 30 mugs, when i pre-heated my mug and then placed to mug press after cooking mug looks very nice, shiny, colors perfect.

And yes all thanx to DSF members, helped a lot.

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Thanks JustBe Good very encouraging, I will paste progress (good or bad). Yes the Forum Members are extremely helpful :-)